Android 8.0 Oreo/ 9.0 Pie

[zlays84]

Is it OK to expect Android Oreo on 2017 Sony Android TVs?

[stormyuk]

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@zer0ner0 wrote:

@rooobb Thanks for the clarifications. My intention is not to argue with anyone or defy their experience or even expertise. My goal is to learn form their experience (on v6.6510 in specific) in order to decide if I should proceed with the update or not, taking also into account that downgrade is not an option.

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@zer0ner0 Out if curiosity when the girls were watching Sabrina in DV on our XG9005 I noticed as you suggested Gamma was set at 0 on activation of DV. It was possible to increase the gamma post the switch to DV. This helped with this particular dark programme.

My experience on the XG9005 (still not updated the XE9005) is all generally positive, yes the menu UI is not as bright but its not unusable in my experience. Everything else seems pretty positive. If you have any specific things you would like me to check on the new Oreo update, feel free to le me know.

[zer0ner0]

@stormyuk 

I have set a custom picture profile, according to the avforums xe9005 guide. According to this, I have manually set gamma to -2 for SDR and when HDR is detected, gamma is automatically set to 0 (among other settings concerning Brightness and X-tended Dynamic Range). I understand that the option to further increase its value is available, but I would rather prefer to stick to the defaults. Unless, Sony acknowledges the need to automatically set the gamma to e.g. 2 instead of 0, upon HDR detection.

As mentioned, my TV is a 55XE9005. With Nougat the TV is responsive, HDR works well for my taste and expertise and all the apps that I rely on for streaming (netflix, primevideo, youtube) are flawless (ok, more or less, don't take it to the bank). Also, a Vero4K+ connected to the TV is cooperating REALLY flawlessly with the TV set. So, my major concern is the possibility that the Oreo update destroys this ease of mind.

So specifically:

I can recall you mentioning a couple of posts before, that HDR Sabrina is as fine in Oreo 6.6510 as it was before. By "before" you mean Nougat, right?

What about the alleged overall brightness degradation? Have you noticed it on your updated XG (actually, I would prefer it if you had updated your XE )? What is your experience?

Since I have enabled subtitles in Netflix and PrimeVideo, I am really interested in the effect that this reported UI/ video brightness difference has on the subtitles. Do they seem grayed out or not? The reports in this thread and in reddit threads are mixed.

Eventually, I am quoting a user ( @S0unnd ) saying: "Lesson learned: if everything works well with your current version, do not update". But, on the other hand a number of users are satisfied with the Oreo update. So, why should I be an exemption? As I mentioned in another forum, hesitant and impatient at the same time.

[stormyuk]

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@zer0ner0 wrote:

@stormyuk 

I have set a custom picture profile, according to the avforums xe9005 guide. According to this, I have manually set gamma to -2 for SDR and when HDR is detected, gamma is automatically set to 0 (among other settings concerning Brightness and X-tended Dynamic Range). I understand that the option to further increase its value is available, but I would rather prefer to stick to the defaults. Unless, Sony acknowledges the need to automatically set the gamma to e.g. 2 instead of 0, upon HDR detection.

As mentioned, my TV is a 55XE9005. With Nougat the TV is responsive, HDR works well for my taste and expertise and all the apps that I rely on for streaming (netflix, primevideo, youtube) are flawless (ok, more or less, don't take it to the bank). Also, a Vero4K+ connected to the TV is cooperating REALLY flawlessly with the TV set. So, my major concern is the possibility that the Oreo update destroys this ease of mind.

So specifically:

I can recall you mentioning a couple of posts before, that HDR Sabrina is as fine in Oreo 6.6510 as it was before. By "before" you mean Nougat, right?

What about the alleged overall brightness degradation? Have you noticed it on your updated XG (actually, I would prefer it if you had updated your XE )? What is your experience?

Since I have enabled subtitles in Netflix and PrimeVideo, I am really interested in the effect that this reported UI/ video brightness difference has on the subtitles. Do they seem grayed out or not? The reports in this thread and in reddit threads are mixed.

Eventually, I am quoting a user ( @S0unnd ) saying: "Lesson learned: if everything works well with your current version, do not update". But, on the other hand a number of users are satisfied with the Oreo update. So, why should I be an exemption? As I mentioned in another forum, hesitant and impatient at the same time.

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Wow, I just spent 10 minutes writting a response and the forum ate it.... I will try again.

Firstly Sabrina was ok on the XE (on Nougat), it was always dark on the XG with DV, but the new update was supposed to improve this, it hasn't really. It won't be a concern for you with respect to the "Gamma" kludge as thats only something I need to do on the XG with Sabrina and Netflix, due to the DV. The XE being HDR10 has never had the problem, so you will be fine there, no change.

With respect to the XG and brightness degradation, I honestly have not noticed a problem, the only issue is the UI and that does not bother me because I always personally found the UI too bright anyway. The XG is overall a bit brighter than the XE but has always had a better HDR contrast than the XE, probably sharing the 2018 XF panel.

I will check subtitles on the XG later and report back, I only generally use them for foriegn language programmes so not using them often.

My XE has always been sluggish with respect to responisveness and the UI and general use, much more so even than the XG out of the box, which I don't quite understand as they all share the same Mediatek SoC (XE, XF, XG9005). It was only the "real" 2019 models such as XG95 et al which got a hardware boost in this respect.

As you say if you are happy with your TV with Nougat then there probably is no real benefit in updating. I initially did the XG because I read that DV was better on Netflix, some programmes are fantastic (such at Stranger Things) and some are dreafully dark (like Sabrina).

Overall on the XG I am happy with Oreo, as DV on certain Netflix programmes was always dark. The XE like you I am a bit more hesitent to update although I hope it would improve the responsiveness.

[Kuschelmonschter]

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@stormyuk  schrieb:
Firstly Sabrina was ok on the XE (on Nougat), it was always dark on the XG with DV, but the new update was supposed to improve this, it hasn't really. It won't be a concern for you with respect to the "Gamma" kludge as thats only something I need to do on the XG with Sabrina and Netflix, due to the DV. The XE being HDR10 has never had the problem, so you will be fine there, no change.

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I do have an XF9005 here and am reading lots of conflicting things about the dimness issue. Here are my findings...

For me, both, conventional HDR (e.g. HDR10) and Dolby Vision look pretty much the same. I did some tests with “The Chilling Adventures of Sabrina” on Netflix. I prefer to look at the 1st episode after minute 20. It is a very dim scene for all the different sources:

• internal Netflix app (in Dolby Vision as it cannot be disabled)
• Apple TV 4K in Dolby Vision mode
• Apple TV 4K in HDR10 mode

I am very confident that this is how the author intended it to look like when watched in a pitch black room. Problem is that such content is hardly to not watchable at daytime and that's a major issue. Sony should really deploy some bright picture presets for HDR and Dolby Vision, like they already do it for XG with the Dolby Vision Bright picture mode.

I will check subtitles on the XG later and report back, I only generally use them for foriegn language programmes so not using them often.

Especially on Netflix, subtitles have always been too bright anyway. It resulted in lots of blooming on LCD. There is however a way to make subtitles semi-transparent via Netflix subtitle preferences.

With respect to the XG and brightness degradation, I honestly have not noticed a problem, the only issue is the UI and that does not bother me because I always personally found the UI too bright anyway.

I created a bug ticket here. Colors are just off. Some menus are hardly readable at daytime. It also affects software decoded video, so everything that does not go through the BRAVIA's own video decoder and picture processing. Kodi for example might use software decoding for some of the easier formats in SD (like MPEG-2 or MPEG-4 ASP).

[stormyuk]

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@Kuschelmonschter wrote:

I am very confident that this is how the author intended it to look like when watched in a pitch black room. Problem is that such content is hardly to not watchable at daytime and that's a major issue. Sony should really deploy some bright picture presets for HDR and Dolby Vision, like they already do it for XG with the Dolby Vision Bright picture mode.

When you say "Dolby Vision Bright" picture mode, what is this exactly? I dont have anything available on my XG9005, is this something on the XG95?

Yup, just checked its on the XG85 and XG95 but not the XG90. Grrrrrr..

Thanks,

[dutchice]

Hi @zer0ner0,

Since I see you have very specific and content-based questions, I thought of posting a short summary of the most important improvements:

1. Android 8.0 Oreo will certainly improve your current user experience with regards to responsiveness thanks to crucial optimisations compared to previous builds
2. Long standing issues which customers have been asking to resolve, have also been introduced and further refined on the May update, a few examples are:
      ●  Correct selection of picture settings (Color Space, Brightness, etc.) for YouTube HDR playback
      ●  Introduction of DTS passthrough for 3rd-party media player apps such as PLEX, Kodi, VLC, etc.
      ●  Smaller TV Menu Bar footprint allowing more of the main content through
      ●  Expansion of the supported AV formats for USB and network playback
      ●  Fixes for picture posterization in dark content for Dolby Vision on Netflix
      ●  Improvements for random HDMI-CEC based issues for connected devices when TV is in standby
3. Android 8.0 Oreo also adds a number of new optimisation features which app developers such as Netflix, Prime Video, YouTube, etc. have now available in order to build further optimisations to their apps. A good real use case example is the latest YouTube app revision 2.06.06 which reduces the use of your TV's limited resources in order to deliver better playback performance. So expect not only existing laggy apps like Google Chromecast to soon make extensive use of the newly available features, but also future apps like Apple TV and Apple TV+ for Sony BRAVIA to also implement the use of these features for optimal user experience.
   
   

Obviously with each update there will always still be unresolved/unintended issues. What customers often forget is that all changes firstly are intended for improving your experience and secondly always have an underlying technical reason. A good example has been the improvement to the behaviour of externally connected devices when TV is in standby mode introduced by Android 8.0 Oreo which inadvertently led to the ARC sound issue. So rest assured that these type of issues will always be addressed in future updates, as there is not such as the perfect update.

Cheers,

Dutchice

[Kuschelmonschter]

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@stormyuk  schrieb:
Yup, just checked its on the XG85 and XG95 but not the XG90. Grrrrrr..

XG90 is the biggest joke anyway. It is a rebranded XF90 with old processor. I really don't get Sony's lineup this year. Makes no sense at all.

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[zer0ner0]

@dutchice, thank you for the motivation post. But my reluctancy is also based on the fact that the v6.5603 bricked my TV one year ago, before the FW had been eventually withdrawn by Sony a few days later. Of course, I updated to v.6.5629 through USB since then, but I have learned the hard way to view Sony FW updates with a grain of salt.

[stormyuk]

@zer0ner0 not the best pics, but no issues with Netflix subtitles. Look as before.

[Kuschelmonschter]

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@rooobb  schrieb:

Google Advertising: the channel was indeed added even before the new firmware release from Sony on the Android TV platform. On my own tv it can be disabled and remain disabled. What about yours?

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It initially mysteriously reappeared every day. At the current time, it indeed stays deactivated. However, now Sony Select channel mysteriously gets reactivated. Something is just wrong with those promotions...

Samba TV: I do not see any difference with previous release. It is there (and I do not even know what can be done with it since it claims it works only with an Ipad) as before and can be disabled as before..

Last Nougat version didn't bother people with Samba TV. It also wasn't part of the settings menu. It was the version released one day before the new privacy law in the EU took action. Might have been different for U.K.