YouTube HDR... finally

[Kuschelmonschter]

YouTube HDR content is finally available!

You will find a playlist here. However, these clips will be played as SDR on Sonys for now.

With youtube-dl you can find vp9.2 encodings for those clips:

330          webm       256x144    144p60  156k , vp9.2, 60fps, video only, 2.38MiB
331          webm       426x240    240p60  256k , vp9.2, 60fps, video only, 3.87MiB
332          webm       640x360    360p60  485k , vp9.2, 60fps, video only, 7.35MiB
333          webm       854x480    480p60  909k , vp9.2, 60fps, video only, 13.83MiB
334          webm       1280x720   720p60 1991k , vp9.2, 60fps, video only, 28.18MiB
335          webm       1920x1080  1080p60 3201k , vp9.2, 60fps, video only, 49.70MiB
336          webm       2560x1440  1440p60 11166k , vp9.2, 60fps, video only, 170.23MiB
337          webm       3840x2160  2160p60 20122k , vp9.2, 60fps, video only, 335.45MiB

Those are webm however which the native Video app won't play.

We will see whether we will get support for it soon, even for the early 2016 models with the old MediaTek SoC from last year. At least Sony promised that back at CES:

Spoiler

YouTube will also start streaming in HDR quality later this year, using a new VP9-Profile 2 codec that brings HDR support to Google’s VP9 video format. Sony’s Motoi Kawamura, Head of TV Product Planning for Sony Europe, confirmed to FlatpanelsHD that the 2016 models will support VP9-Profile 2 and be capable of streaming YouTube in HDR. We saw a demo at CES and it looked very good.

Source

[Itom86]

Great, quite annoying. Back in time I thought 38 mb broadband must be enough for everything...

On the other hand, I'm not sure I want to double up my speed, because it will restart 18 month contract 😁

Let's say 1440p/60fps still looks amazing 🙂

[Jecht_Sin]

@Itom86 Yeah.. 1440p is fine. And then it's only for the 60 fps YouTube video, which aren't a lot anyway.

The only issue is the compression. I am not sure YouTube uses the best algorithms, because with that bitrate the quality should be very good, instead I can get a lot of artefacts (in some cases even pixelation!) even at 2160p. I wonder if they use HEVC, and if they don't, why. That would save a load of bandwidth. At least for the UHD videos, not many watchign 1080p videos only may have HEVC supported . 

[Kuschelmonschter]

As already written several times, Google's primary codec is their own VP9 which is not bad in my opinion. Not as efficient as HEVC but royalty-free...

[Jecht_Sin]

Ok, sorry. I thought HEVC was like an extra step of compression. My bad, I'm still noobish!

So, let's say.. if an H264 file has size 100, in HEVC it should be about 50 (half of it I read). What would be the size in VP9? Actually never mind. I've found this interesting article that says HEVC is about 20% more efficient than VP9. And soon there should  be a new player that should replace VP9: AV1. I wouldn't be surprised if our SoCs won't support it, though...

[Kuschelmonschter]

Yes, the Netflix codec comparison is pretty meaningful. I still prefer VP9 over HEVC due to its royalty-freeness. You just have to throw some more bits at it maybe. I am not sure whether the blockyness you witness sometimes is really due to VP9 toolbox efficiency or just some bad encoder decisions. Things like that are constantly improving.

Today's SoCs for sure don't support VP10/AV1.

[Jecht_Sin]

@Kuschelmonschter Another thing I don't understand. You wrote long ago that VP9.2 for the HDR isn't supported by the MT5890 (while it should be by the MT5891). And that HEVC is managed by an extra chip (an ASIC?). So I have a couple of questions:

• What is actually decoding VP9/VP9.2 in our TVs
• If it is another chip, why does it need the GPU to support it
• Same for H264 and HEVC

If you have the time i'd be grateful. This has been puzzling me for quite a bit, now. 

[Kuschelmonschter]

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Jecht_Sin schrieb:
What is actually decoding VP9/VP9.2 in our TVs

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Weak CPU/GPU inside MediaTek Android TV SoCs are not capable of decoding any video format in software. Kodi for example still decodes SD MPEG-4 ASP files in SW for which real-time decoding fails already.

All modern formats are decoded by an ASIC, including H.264/AVC, H.265/HEVC, VP9 and VP9.2 on the newer MT5891, also see my Sony TV review.

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If it is another chip, why does it need the GPU to support it

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Video decoder ASIC is just another functional block on the SoC. The output is typically rendered via OpenGL which is where the GPU then comes into play.

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Same for H264 and HEVC

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Works the same for all supported codecs.

[Jecht_Sin]

Aww... So the ASIC is stll part of the SoC, but it has nothing to do with the GPU. I thought it was an external chip. So, basically these SoCs have powerful decoders but awful CPU/GPU?

Surfing Amazon I've found this HP96 Pro+ the other day. Not that I'm interested on buying it, but it has 8 cores, 3GB RAM, and a Gigabit ethernet port (and they even give a BT keyboard with touchpad! All for 100€). Sure Sony could come out with similar specs.. Not to mention that it has been updated to Android 7.1.2!

Just out of curiosity I wonder if it plays YouTube in HDR as well. 

[Kuschelmonschter]

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Surfing Amazon I've found this HP96 Pro+ the other day. Not that I'm interested on buying it, but it has 8 cores, 3GB RAM, and a Gigabit ethernet port (and they even give a BT keyboard with touchpad! All for 100€). Sure Sony could come out with similar specs.. Not to mention that it has been updated to Android 7.1.2!

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Be very careful with those boxes. Firmware is typically much worse than Sony's. Most of them can't even do Netflix or only up to HD. AMLogic S912 does not support VP9.2. I don't know whether any of those boxes can actually do HDR...

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Aww... So the ASIC is stll part of the SoC, but it has nothing to do with the GPU. I thought it was an external chip. So, basically these SoCs have powerful decoders but awful CPU/GPU?

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There is nothing fancy about the decoder either. It supports all modern formats up to 2160p60. Intel Quick Sync is something I would call fancy where you can encode and decode several video streams in parallel.

[Jecht_Sin]

Well, I meant powerful compared to some other boxes you mentioned before. Also compared to the incredibly awful CPU/GPU couple! 

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@Kuschelmonschter wrote:

Be very careful with those boxes. Firmware is typically much worse than Sony's. Most of them can't even do Netflix or only up to HD. AMLogic S912 does not support VP9.2. I don't know whether any of those boxes can actually do HDR...

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Out of curiosity I have checked the specs of the Amlogic S912, which being the eptacore model should be the one inside the box I posted earlier. It says it supports Dolby Vision and HDR10. It also says vp9, but nothing about vp9.2. Although I am not sure if with vp9 they include vp9.2 as well.